Video: "The Pinehurst Effect and Collateral Damage"

Randy Wilson's video's are always enjoyable, but his post-Pinehurst summary is particularly fun considering how much golfers continue to debate what they saw over the two weeks at No. 2.

I highly recommend his latest, especially if you know some doubters.

Oh and Wally do check out the comments at the end. Add Randy to the radar!

Comments

[Blue Canyon]

good vid.
agree w/ the names he presents, but I would add Mike Clayton as an influence in my F&F education

[Mike]

It was a dull US Open. Looked more like the Buick Open. US Open courses need thick punishing rough, some water hazards and more tree lined fairways. Don't go back to Pinehurst.

[Lynn S.]

Mike

Or hit Martin Kaymer with a frying pan.

[Tommy Naccarato]

Simply brilliant Randy! Could I borrow that frying pan, I need to talk to poster #2! LOL!

Kudos on the Don Mahaffey mention! Add Jeff Hicks in there too!

[dbh]

Lol, LS. I loved the frying pan. Especially the off cam, sound only, iterations. Hilarious.

[paul]

Oh good lord. Get away from the high priced, over hyped courses and there are plenty of hard and fast public courses. I'm so tired of hearing about hard and fast. Every cheap public course I know of can get fast and firm...and brown..if the weather calls for it. Like it's some new revolution...start going back to public/private courses that don't cost an arm and a leg..with no big name course architect and you can get what you want for a fraction of the cost.I have a feeling that wouldn't be good enough for some of the people pushing for PH#2 conditions.
Many of these courses barely water now! But hey...it's been a marvelous weather year here in the Midwest and we are still playing green....thank goodness...lol
Paul

[scots wha hae]

Pure dead brilliant!

[DTF]

3 questions...

1. How much did it cost to redo the course?

2. How much is the green fee now?

3. Who owns the place these days?

[meefer]

Well kept tee boxes. Well kept greens. Mow the rough when required. Let the fairways do what they do with enough water to keep them from dying out. And, don't rake the bunkers, they're hazards.

[Jersey Mike]

There is so much violence in the world. The frying pan to the head did not make me laugh. Otherwise, there were some great points made.

[KLG]

Really? The frying pan did make me laugh. Out loud. Guess that's because I'm of a certain age (Golden Age of Hanna Barbera):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKYs-N7VAhg
El Kabong!

[TLB]

@ DTF. Don't know the answer to your first 2 questions, but I think it's still owned by the Demond Family, son of the founder of Club Corp. He kept Pinehurst when he sold to KSL

[dbh]

@jersey mike,
what KLG said and if you really want to mortify yourself, google 'termite terrace'...

[gov. lepetomane]

I liked the points he made. The Pinehurst No. 2 presentation was fine, very worthy of a US Open. As a competition week two was more exciting than week one.

My favorite course of all time is a muni I grew up near, some 300 yards from the 1st fairway. It's a supposed Donald Ross design. In fact it's one of those that Ross's teams built. He may have never set foot on it. And the few turtle back greens of my youth have been flattened to make play faster because it's volume that keeps a muni in the black. The course is like Pinehurst in that it is firm and fast and the greens are pretty fast by muni standards. Any resemblance ends there. The course property does not lend itself to lengthening; they are landlocked (probably good because it avoids the unnecessary cost of building new teeing grounds). It is still a cool course, in very decent condition and quite affordable. I would be happy to play it with a rolled back ball. If the USGA were roll back, the legal wrangling would be quite entertaining. It would make groove configuration or anchoring look like a walk in the park.

Despite supporting Pinehurst No. 2 I thoroughly enjoy watching the play at ANGC annually and if given a chance to play any course in the US, I would pick the exclusive Cypress Point, not Pinehurst No. 2 or Pine Valley.

[ol Harv]

@DTF, I believe it's $410 and yes Robert Dedman owns Pinehurst Resort. PFD probably knows the reno cost.

[ol Harv]

By the way, I talked with a good friend today whose family owned a house that backed up to No.2 and he was a former member who may have won their club championship at one point; he knows golf. He was astounded by the burned out look, especially around the greens. I told him the lies were still good and the players had no complaints but he was really upset about the "brown" look of the Bermuda fairways. I tried, but I couldn't sell him.

[Chris Cupit]

Randy does a great job with these videos and I appreciate his shout out for my superintendent, Mark Hoban! At some point the industry will face a regulatory environment where wall to wall green simply isn't possible for 99% of golf courses--I guess I am in the monority but I can't wait for that to happen :) Well, maybe I can wait since I hate being forced into anything but acres and acres of irrigated, lush green grass is hard to defend in any way, shape or form.

Thanks for posting Geoff

Chris Cupit
Rivermont GC

[ol Harv]

Coore-Crenshaw renovation DTF: $2.5 million.

[DTF]

Some neat videos in there. Some of them don't play too good but the ones I've gotten to play are interesting.

Does the Pinehurst Resort plan to "transform" all the rest of their courses in a similar fashion?

[BenSeattle]

Good lord.... 5 minutes and 49 seconds of my life I'll never get back. As David Letterman once said, "Comedy is dangerous... leave it to the professionals." Whoever "Randy" is, he said nothing new and stayed on camera WAAAAY too long. (Doesn't he know that a "talking head" is the death of video?) The sentiment towards more "natural, water-conserving golf" makes sense but low-rent slapstick such as this isn't going to convince anybody. Stunned that other posters aren't more discerning. But that's just me.

[tlavin]

Please, Jesus, spare me the aw shucks fake hillbilly minimalist comic. Off my radar.

[Crossen]

The name dropping...the Honey-Boo-Boo-dumb-southern-cracker stereotyping...the continued hyperawareness that Kaymer is German, as though it means anything...the call for a ball rollback, which is puerile and will never happen...the notion that darts-at-the-flag golf happens in evil America and nowhere else...the exaggerated claim that Ben Crenshaw is a true force in golf history awareness when in actuality he's a blip...there is much that doesn't appeal to me. But I admire the fellow's passion, and the time and effort he spent to get his point across. At least he's putting his thoughts to action. And I googled the sponsor product!

[ol Harv]

"the exaggerated claim that Ben Crenshaw is a true force in golf history awareness when in actuality he's a blip.."

Please explain this thought Crossen?

[KLG]

"Do not watch if you are sensitive to split infinitives, overly simplistic problem-solving and blatant Luddism."

And by all means leave the puerility to those of us who can handle it. Especially cart boys named Tillinghast, was it?

Anyway, the most important thing I learned browsing around that website earlier this evening is the root of "Luddism" is "Ludell." I should have known.

Don't forget to re-read your Thomas Jefferson in the morning! He would have played it down.

[V60golfrrr]

I like all the green grass behind him, isn't it ironic?

[PABoy]

When in the course of human events...

I am an average golfer but I like to think I am better than average...

Two great quotes that reflect all of my thoughts this July 4th Weekend. Go low everyone.

A Yankee and a Randy Wilson fan.

[4PuttAficionado (F3PA)]

410 dollars a round at No 2? All that money they save on water and maintenance will go right to the bottom line. And free US Open advertising! What a scam.
Keep pushing that Pinehurst propaganda!

[Colin MacGillivray]

One of the best outcomes of this years Open is now we can talk about a type of golf course architecture- Pinehurst No2. So clients may ask their architect for a "Pinehurst No2 with a few concave greens along the way for the old guys!

[Colin MacGillivray]

One of the best outcomes of this years Open is now we can talk about a type of golf course architecture- Pinehurst No2. So clients may ask their architect for a "Pinehurst No2 with a few concave greens along the way for the old guys!

[The Pro from Dover]

@ 4Putt Inside info revealed that during the month of May leading up to the Back-to-back Opens, #2 had almost 6K rounds @ $410. With those kind of numbers I would say they are taking plenty to the bottom line.

Following the large pay day from the USGA for hosting the two Opens, plus the residual impact of charging $410 for #2, I would say Pinehurst Resort &CC is well in the black.

Does anyone have any inside info as to what the USGA paid Pinehurst for the two weeks +??

The resort and club is the largest employer other than Health First in the area, so the PR&CC feed a lot of mouths.

We must remember, Bob Dedman and CCA actually 'saved' Pinehurst R & CC and the village itself with their investment some 30 years ago.

@ Ol Harv $2.5M is correct, or at least close enough. That does not include the "no till" process for the Champion Bermuda greens going on now. Sprigging starts Monday. Was out there day before yesterday watching green ix being added to the green complexes.

[4PuttAficionado (F3PA)]

I applaud their business model! I can see more courses putting down dirt and non-tumbling weeds in place of rough and removing irrigation. You can work with a smaller maintenance crew and less equipment as well! Then you host a Major and charge 452 bucks for golf tourists to play on the same turtle back saucer greens n' browns as the pros. Brilliant! (I'll call mine Dusty Meadows CC ™)

[Blue Canyon]

I was wrong on one thing at least - I thought audience on this website would be 100% in favor of the Pinehurst presentation - firm playing surfaces and the imminent change to reduced maintenance.

[Carl Peterson]

"...would be 100% in favor..."

First day on the interwebs?

[ol Harv]

@4putt, You are right to call out Pinehurst for not passing on the money saved from less water and overall maintenance, but from everything I've heard and read C & C did not do the renovation based on that. By "going back" in time the maintenance savings just sort of came about because they did not need the water reaching those sandscape areas. Yes it would be nice for those of us who cannot justify spending $410 to play the course, but they are evidently getting it. Other golf courses though can definitely pass on those savings with decreased maintenance costs if they choose to eliminate un-needed green grass areas. For many facilities it will be a way to survive. Based on many reports in terms of water restrictions, the brown look is something that golfers will have to learn to live with in certain parts of our country.

[P-Dog]

To assume a 'natural' look is suddenly less expensive, might be a bit of a reach. I'm pretty sure the super at Pinehurst would confirm that. Weed abatement alone is very real on these types of courses as it's extremely labor intensive. Don't kid yourself to think they aren't watering either.

My father hated the look, asking me if they ran out of water or something. I tried to explain it was intentional but he wasnt buying it. When I have him out to play at my club, all he talks about is how pretty and green it is. Acceptance of a more natural golfing environment would seem very generational.

[ol Harv]

Pdog, They dropped their water usage on No 2 from 55 million gallons annually to 15 million gallons. No one is claiming they aren't watering. And obviously the sandscapes need some form of maintenance, but the key word here is LESS. Less water, less fertilizer, less chemicals, less mowing, less overall maintenance costs.

[tlavin]

Anybody think the other courses at Pinehurst will get sandy re-do's? I rather doubt it. This is 100% marketing. Good marketing, but PR nonetheless, not an environmental movement as such.

[Colin MacGillivray]

Hey guys- look at Australian sand belt courses in the summer- in Adelaide little rain for 4 months and some 40 degree days (that's 100F) and no watering. Pinehurst 2 is very close to Aussie sandbelt.
There's nothing new under the sun.
And there is no view on this website that we all agree with. (Except perhaps deriding the Donald's hair.)

[tlavin]

I know what you're talking about, but in the US, I'm thinking this is what we call a one-trick pony.

[Ian Andrew]

Thanks Geoff, that was a great piece.