Setup Run Amok Files: NCAA Women's Finals At Concession

As the NCAA Women's Golf Championship prepares to whittle its field from stroke play to the match play finalists (and gets Golf Channel coverage Monday-Wednesday), Ryan Lavner assesses a course setup that appears to have gotten out of hand. (17 of the 24 teams posted their worst 18-hole score of the year.)

Yes, most of the top teams will advance to match play, but in recent years the NCAA's have suffered from questionable setups (Prairie Dunes bathed in rough for the men last year) and the women facing what sounds like an excessive test at Concession has many worried about what we'll see on TV.

Women’s college golf hasn’t been on national television in years, and everyone hopes to make a good impression when the cameras start rolling for real Monday afternoon. That’s problematic now, Washington coach Mary Lou Mulflur says, because “people will see teams 40 over par in the mix, and it doesn’t make us look very good.”

“This setup is the most difficult I’ve been on,” Alabama coach Mic Potter said. “And I don’t think that’s a bad thing, as long as it doesn’t hurt the perception of our sport.”

Comments

[D. maculata]

Played it before CIA clearance was required to get through the gate (same 6440 tees as the NCAA Women) and to watch a few hours of the Concession Cup. It's a tough nut to crack but it appears there's a difference of opinion regarding what's more important; a good impression for TV or the challenge? In that regard I tend to agree with coach Potter. Lets not get too excited about the setup until we see how the men do. You just can't force it here from the wrong position - See Pete Dye, French Lick. When conditions are brutal, the player that takes what the course gives him tends to win almost every damn time. Regardless of the setup there are courses better suited for match than medal play. And Concession is one of them. IMO it's less annoying than being paired with Kevin Na on a course ripe for birdies.

[Pat(another one)]

What gets lost here is that "40 over par" is just a random number. If they would focus on the stroke totals instead of relation to par, no one would care about "it doesn't look good." If it's windy, shots are tougher to hit. And these are college players, quasi professional under the strict definition, but certainly not professional on the basis of their play.

Almost sounds like a coach concerned about a resume moreso than anything.

[Johnnnycz]

Sounds like an amateur (or not very experienced) committee set up the course with the focus on "harder is better" mindset. Nothing wrong with a setup that allows for under par scores. The basic 6-6-6 is best. 6 easy pins, 6 average, and 6 sucker/disaster hole locations is usually the fairest. IMO...a center of green pin is a valid challenge for better players even though it's not "sexy" like tucking the pin behind a deep bunker.

Course looks great on camera though. So that's a bonus for someone.

[Chris Cupit]

I do not leave for the Men's Championship until Thursday so I cannot speak to the set-up currently. However, I was at Prairie Dunes last year for the entire week and have no idea what you are referring to re: Prairie Dunes "bathed in rough"? Both players and coaches were extreemely complimentary of the course and set up last year and frankly, I have been there and played numerous times and the rough seemd like "typical" Prairie Dunes rough.

The first cut was not onerous at all and while the tall stuff is brutal, when is it not at Prairie Dunes? Most importantly, fairways were not excessively narrowed and with very light to non existant winds, the course yeilded many good scores. Here is a link to last year's scores: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_NCAA_Division_I_Men%27s_Golf_Championship

There was a 63, several 65's and if you wanted to even finish in the top 12 as an individual you had to shoot -3, 207 (Par was 70) so how the set-up was "questionable" seems like a questionable description :)

Also, the average score required last year to advance to the Match Play portion of the Championship was 839.25--an avergae of -1 as a team for the three days of stroke play.

Just one quick observation from last year: Holes 17 and 18 did seem slightly narrower than I remmeber playing them. However there was nothing crazy and 17 was a middle iron second shot for the longer hitters as a par-5 and the heavy rough was quite wide on 17. Yes, if you missed the fairway you had to lay up from the first cut but so what! On 18, it did get tight if you hit a longer club off the tee but most kids used irons (in match play I saw a 5-iron and then PW) and laid back to a very ample width.

Anyway, if anyone wants to be drawn into a Golf CLub Atlas "debate" here are some thoughts on last year at PD from that site: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58603.0.html

Bottom line is that there will be great players competing for a National Championship at Concession and hopefully everyone can get some time to watch on the Golf Channel!

Chris Cupit

[Chris Cupit]

I do not leave for the Men's Championship until Thursday so I cannot speak to the set-up currently. However, I was at Prairie Dunes last year for the entire week and have no idea what you are referring to re: Prairie Dunes "bathed in rough"? Both players and coaches were extreemely complimentary of the course and set up last year and frankly, I have been there and played numerous times and the rough seemd like "typical" Prairie Dunes rough.

The first cut was not onerous at all and while the tall stuff is brutal, when is it not at Prairie Dunes? Most importantly, fairways were not excessively narrowed and with very light to non existant winds, the course yeilded many good scores. Here is a link to last year's scores: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_NCAA_Division_I_Men%27s_Golf_Championship

There was a 63, several 65's and if you wanted to even finish in the top 12 as an individual you had to shoot -3, 207 (Par was 70) so how the set-up was "questionable" seems like a questionable description :)

Also, the average score required last year to advance to the Match Play portion of the Championship was 839.25--an avergae of -1 as a team for the three days of stroke play.

Just one quick observation from last year: Holes 17 and 18 did seem slightly narrower than I remmeber playing them. However there was nothing crazy and 17 was a middle iron second shot for the longer hitters as a par-5 and the heavy rough was quite wide on 17. Yes, if you missed the fairway you had to lay up from the first cut but so what! On 18, it did get tight if you hit a longer club off the tee but most kids used irons (in match play I saw a 5-iron and then PW) and laid back to a very ample width.

Anyway, if anyone wants to be drawn into a Golf CLub Atlas "debate" here are some thoughts on last year at PD from that site: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58603.0.html

Bottom line is that there will be great players competing for a National Championship at Concession and hopefully everyone can get some time to watch on the Golf Channel!

Chris Cupit

[Pitbull]

Chris
GolfClubAtlas "debates" are "moronic" - please don't infect that mental masturbation attitude to this fine site.

Prairie Dunes looked and played great last year. Those kids showed us they can play and some are proving it at a higher level this year.

[GW]

I was at the Dunes for the NCAAs last year, and I agree with Chris--the rough wasn't anything it isn't normally. The winning score was Cameron Wilson at -6. Compare this to the U.S. Women's Open in '02 (Juli Inkster -4) and U.S. Senior Open in '06 (Allen Doyle -8). And remember due to the thunderstorms it was only 54 holes not 72 like the Opens.

[PG]

http://collegiategolf.com/news/arnold-palmer-and-gcaa-announce-changes-to-arnold-palmer-cup-2187.html

[Jeremy]

You mean Geoff lobbed criticism at a setup he never actually saw in person? No way!

[TLB]

Southern California???? Must mean USC. Never Southern California or Southern Cal.

[Convert]

If it is all just relative, then why not make the girls play the course at 7000 yards? Agree with cz, an amateur setup for sure.

[Solly]

The first page of the individual leaderboard was around 20 under today. It's not like there are 50 women's college golfers that could shoot par or better on a championship layout on any given day, anyways. Realistically there are probably only 100 women in the world that are good enough to shoot par or better on a championship layout on any given day. It might sound harsh, but look at the scores each week in the world of women's golf.

[Brom Bones]

+1 to Chris C and GW

I played 3rounds at PD the week before the NCAAs And can relate that there were no real changes to width or rough difficulty from what we play as members. The gunch was as penal as always, however. In fact, the course was probably slightly benign Due to the extra preparation by the outstanding turf crew out there. I slapped it around regardless...

[smails]

coaches complaining about the set up?

[ol Harv]

"Sounds like an amateur (or not very experienced) committee set up the course with the focus on "harder is better" mindset. Nothing wrong with a setup that allows for under par scores."

Absolutely Johnny, couldn't agree more. I'm always amazed at that mindset.